By Olyy
#68584
https://x.com/EnglandRugby/status/17976 ... WAyDA&s=19

Latest training camp squad - congrats to Bev, Ben, Tom, George, Joe, Tom R and Raffi!
Definitely wasn't expecting a double serving of Curry in there, even if it is just a training camp

Little surprised at no Harper, considering it's a training squad, and what more can you really learn about Cole by having him in camp for an extra week or two?
Also a bit surprised at Raffi being called up


Edit: just noticed the preview isn't working above

Forwards
Fin Baxter (Harlequins)
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers)
Chandler Cunningham-South (Harlequins)
Ben Curry (Sale Sharks)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks)
Theo Dan (Saracens)
Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins)
Ben Earl (Saracens)
Greg Fisilau (Exeter Chiefs)
Jamie George (Saracens)
Joe Heyes (Leicester Tigers)
Nick Isiekwe (Saracens)
Maro Itoje (Saracens)
Joe Marler (Harlequins)
George Martin (Leicester Tigers)
Gabriel Oghre (Bristol Bears)
Bevan Rodd (Sale Sharks)
Ethan Roots (Exeter Chiefs)
Rusi Tuima (Exeter Chiefs)
Tom Willis (Saracens)

Backs
Charlie Atkinson (Gloucester Rugby)
Joe Carpenter (Sale Sharks)
Immanuel Feyi-Waboso (Exeter Chiefs)
George Ford (Sale Sharks)
Max Malins (Bristol Bears)
Luke Northmore (Harlequins)
Raffi Quirke (Sale Sharks)
Harry Randall (Bristol Bears)
Tom Roebuck (Sale Sharks)
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs)
Marcus Smith (Harlequins)
Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers)
Jack van Poortvliet (Leicester Tigers)
Last edited by Olyy on Wed Jun 12, 2024 1:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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By RinTin
#68585
Looks good. Agree re Harper. No LCD in there and a little gutted Dugdale didn’t get a look in.

Curry in, Pepper out is the one I noticed. Ben couldn’t really be ignored this season.
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By Olyy
#68586
I wonder if LCD is unavailable?
Can't imagine he wouldn't have been in the 23 on Saturday if he was fit - and can't see Oghre being ahead of him if he's able to train.
Could be a call up in the next squad naming, or could be that he has to miss the summer if his neck isn't right or anything like that


Be interesting to see the makeup of the squad after the finalists join up - I reckon Underhill comes in for one of the Curry's (is Tom there to get a look at or actually going to go to Japan/NZ? Part of me thinks they'll give him the summer off but want a closer look at him in this camp first) but as much as I rate Pearson I'd be really disappointed if he toured over Ben with how little he's played this side of the 6N
By RinTin
#68590
Olyy wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2024 8:19 pm
I wonder if LCD is unavailable?
Can't imagine he wouldn't have been in the 23 on Saturday if he was fit - and can't see Oghre being ahead of him if he's able to train.
Could be a call up in the next squad naming, or could be that he has to miss the summer if his neck isn't right or anything like that


Be interesting to see the makeup of the squad after the finalists join up - I reckon Underhill comes in for one of the Curry's (is Tom there to get a look at or actually going to go to Japan/NZ? Part of me thinks they'll give him the summer off but want a closer look at him in this camp first) but as much as I rate Pearson I'd be really disappointed if he toured over Ben with how little he's played this side of the 6N
IMO Oghre is ahead of LCD. I think Oghre has been outstanding this year. Regardless though it'll be Langdon deservedly taking the third hooker slot for the tour with George and Dan.

The obvious characters will join the squad - Furbank, Freeman, Dingwall, F Smith, Mitchell and Langdon from Saints. Muir, Ojomoh, Lawrence, Underhill from Bath. I would like Ted Hill, Obano, Sleightholme and Trevor Davison to get opportunities too given it's a training squad only at this point.
By Olyy
#68591
Oghre's a decent rugby player and could make a good flanker, but think he's a poor hooker - his performance vs Saracens pretty much cost Bristol a playoff spot - they couldn't get anything going with how bad his lineout was
He's definitely made improvements there since his Wasps days, which were even worse, but he can go three games with a good lineout and then the fourth is absolutely abysmal

Then again LCD's lineout has been really poor post Six Nations

Agree that it's Langdon that gets the nod, if George wasn't captain (if he still is - he was named as 6N captain initially but presume that'll carry through to next season) I'd say he's a clear starter with the form he's in
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By Yareet
#68592
Olyy wrote:
Tue Jun 04, 2024 8:23 am
Oghre's a decent rugby player and could make a good flanker, but think he's a poor hooker - his performance vs Saracens pretty much cost Bristol a playoff spot - they couldn't get anything going with how bad his lineout was
He's definitely made improvements there since his Wasps days, which were even worse, but he can go three games with a good lineout and then the fourth is absolutely abysmal

Then again LCD's lineout has been really poor post Six Nations

Agree that it's Langdon that gets the nod, if George wasn't captain (if he still is - he was named as 6N captain initially but presume that'll carry through to next season) I'd say he's a clear starter with the form he's in
I’d start Curtis v Japan and see how he does.
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By RinTin
#68654
Moving on from a pretty exciting season to the summer tour with the final squad announcement imminent.

Due to Obano's brain fart (and likely ban) Bevan Rodd looks like first choice loosehead for the tour by my reckoning.

Sale lads I think will be taken - Rodd, Ben Curry, Ford, Roebuck, Carpenter. I'm expecting Borthwick to drop Steward and take Furbank as first choice 15 with Carps as his back up to have a good look at him.

My God Sam Underhill looked good yesterday. Looking forward to him piling into the NZ attackers.
By Olyy
#68655
Baxter and Marler will both be ahead of Bevan I think, but reckon Bev should get some game time

I wonder if Finn Smith's injury yesterday, if it does put him out of the tour, might leave the door open for one of Roebuck or Carpenter to tour - I don't think they'd take three flyhalves if Finn isn't fit, considering it's only a three game tour, so could that spot go to a different backline position?
By RinTin
#68656
I see your point re numbers, but the squad will still be 33 players. Couple that with the first game being against a traditionally weaker opposition and I would expect a few newbies to have an opportunity.
By RinTin
#68660
Olyy wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2024 12:12 pm
Is 33 confirmed?
I know that's how many are in training atm but last tour we took 36
If it’s 36 then that’s plenty of space for 3 fly halves plus newbies. Moot point with Ford out. Smith squared the options at 10 which I’m ok with. Furbank emergency back up.
By Olyy
#68662
Are there three flyhalves good enough though? Especially if Finn Smith is out (I've not heard that he is or anything, but his injury yesterday was bad enough to force him off the pitch in a grand final)

Atkinson has been, barring one or two games, dreadful this season - would we take Skinner too? Maybe an u20s guy as an apprentice?

Better off just taking the two Smiths and an extra centre or 15 imo
By RinTin
#68669
Olyy wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2024 12:54 pm
Are there three flyhalves good enough though? Especially if Finn Smith is out (I've not heard that he is or anything, but his injury yesterday was bad enough to force him off the pitch in a grand final)

Atkinson has been, barring one or two games, dreadful this season - would we take Skinner too? Maybe an u20s guy as an apprentice?

Better off just taking the two Smiths and an extra centre or 15 imo
Get your point. We're saying the same thing really as my original point was about taking Roebuck and Carps on tour when there is plenty of space in the squad. Ford being out creates opportunities for others.

If just M Smith available at FH then Charlie Atkinson looks next in line as he's been in the training squad, although I believe SB made a mistake not looking more closely at Harvey Skinner. Furbank will likely be viewed as a back up 10 as well. Malins used to be very handy at 10 but hasn'tplayed there for years so unlikely to offer any sort of back up.

Daly not touring is problematic for SB as he covers 13, wing and fb. This means Steve has to likely take 2 players to cover the spaces Daly is leaving.
By Olyy
#68680
Surprised, but delighted, at the call ups!
I thought it'd be one of the twins and one of Roebuck vs Carpenter - hopefully see a few of them get some good game time (maybe Carps could even get a start vs Japan if Furbank is rested post-final?)

Feel the same about Tom, but gotta trust in the medical staff - Axe said Tom has been very mature about his recovery and not wanted to push deadlines sooner or anything like that, so hopefully he is fully 100% (certainly looked it vs Bath)

Surprised and disappointed not to see Langdon there - if it's the knock he took to his arm in the final then fair enough, but if not then it's madness!


Link to full squad:
https://www.englandrugby.com/news/artic ... land-squad
By RinTin
#68681
Great news for all involved and you can't really say our selected lads going didn't deserve it on form. TC obvious exception, but if he is fit he gets a squad place.

The Japan game will surely see some new blood getting on the pitch. Hopefully Roebuck and Carps get first caps and I would love to see Ben given the 7 shirt from the off. Double Curry for England at last??

Very exciting backs picked as well. I am excited about this tour and really see this selection as a new dawn. In form, young players everywhere.
By RuggerPleb
#68702
Is this the first time that the Currys have toured together? They were both in the squad (away?? or home??) at the beginning of their careers, the infamous BenGetsPickedOverTom-BenGetsInjured-TomReplacesHim-ManOfTheMatch-TomEnglandRegular-BenDropped.... but since then?

Wonder if they will room together.. or have they had enough of the twins thing?

Think Roebuck and Carps are room mates too aren't they? Nice time away for them too.

Bevan will have to find a new mate. :hug:
By wrinklieshark
#68704
It's available to watch free on Rugbypass, apparently.
Can someone who understands these things please explain in words of one syllable how I can watch at a more civilised time than 6.50 am. Thank you!

WAYS TO WATCH
Watch on your laptop, mobile or tablet at rugbypass.tv
Download RugbyPass TV App for iOS or Android for enhanced features such as Chromecast, Airplay to enable streaming in HD on your TV
ENGLAND’S SUMMER SERIES
Japan v England, Saturday 22 June, National Stadium, kick-off 6.50am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 6 July, Forsyth Barr Stadium, kick-off 8.05am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 13 July, Eden Park, kick-off 8.05am BST
User avatar
By Yareet
#68705
wrinklieshark wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2024 10:13 pm
It's available to watch free on Rugbypass, apparently.
Can someone who understands these things please explain in words of one syllable how I can watch at a more civilised time than 6.50 am. Thank you!

WAYS TO WATCH
Watch on your laptop, mobile or tablet at rugbypass.tv
Download RugbyPass TV App for iOS or Android for enhanced features such as Chromecast, Airplay to enable streaming in HD on your TV
ENGLAND’S SUMMER SERIES
Japan v England, Saturday 22 June, National Stadium, kick-off 6.50am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 6 July, Forsyth Barr Stadium, kick-off 8.05am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 13 July, Eden Park, kick-off 8.05am BST
You need to sign up which does mean you will get to watch the refs doc with Wayne Barnes et al.

Though there are not a lot of live games on the app now, there is the whole of day 3 of the spain comp so it would seem that games are kept on the app for a while too.


One syllable is tough!
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By Major Bloodnok
#68707
RinTin wrote:
Wed Jun 12, 2024 8:03 am
Olyy wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2024 8:55 pm
Waisea named in the Fiji squad for their summer tests
https://x.com/fijirugby/status/17986149 ... r1Mdw&s=19
I find that baffling as he hasn't played since February. I hope they don't force him into a game this summer and crock him.
What, a new Sale signing not getting injured just before joining us? Have you no respect for ancient tradition?
RinTin, Olyy, ledzepsfr and 1 others liked this
By Olyy
#68708
Yareet wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2024 10:48 pm
wrinklieshark wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2024 10:13 pm
It's available to watch free on Rugbypass, apparently.
Can someone who understands these things please explain in words of one syllable how I can watch at a more civilised time than 6.50 am. Thank you!

WAYS TO WATCH
Watch on your laptop, mobile or tablet at rugbypass.tv
Download RugbyPass TV App for iOS or Android for enhanced features such as Chromecast, Airplay to enable streaming in HD on your TV
ENGLAND’S SUMMER SERIES
Japan v England, Saturday 22 June, National Stadium, kick-off 6.50am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 6 July, Forsyth Barr Stadium, kick-off 8.05am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 13 July, Eden Park, kick-off 8.05am BST
You need to sign up which does mean you will get to watch the refs doc with Wayne Barnes et al.

Though there are not a lot of live games on the app now, there is the whole of day 3 of the spain comp so it would seem that games are kept on the app for a while too.


One syllable is tough!
Just on this: I'm pretty sure that it's only the Japan game that is on RugbyPass, the two New Zealand tests are on Sky
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By Yareet
#68713
Olyy wrote:
Wed Jun 12, 2024 1:22 pm
Warr and Reed named in the Scotland squad, congratulations to them
Whilst this is great for them, it looks like a big impact to our EQP numbers. Last I saw, from next season clubs must have 15 EQPs per match day squad.

If we assume a fully fit XXIII of:

Rodd
LCD
Sharky
Hill
JLdP
Tom
Ben
DdP
Quirke
Ford
Roebuck
RdP
Nayacalevu

TOF
Carpenter

Taylor
SiMac
Harper/Asher
EvR
Dugdale
Warr
Addison
Reed

I reckon that's 16 EQPs. Doesn't give us much wiggle room. More juggling for Alex.
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By RinTin
#68714
As much of a shame as it may seen, I could see Gus losing game time for us if he gets capped. Nye will be given opportunities. Could be the same with Reed as well with Ene and Wills given opportunities. Reed's contract is up at the end of next season anyway so, if he is lucky enough to get capped, I would imagine he'll head north.

I do rate them both, but I would want the DP's, Naya, Van Rhyn, Addison in that 23 as much as possible. Hell Andrews was critical in our final few games.

Additional note - RDP would be EQP by now if he hadn't have played 8 minutes, yes 8 MINUTES, or SA's game against Wales in June 2018. 1 and only cap.
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By Yareet
#68717
RinTin wrote:
Wed Jun 12, 2024 3:26 pm
As much of a shame as it may seen, I could see Gus losing game time for us if he gets capped. Nye will be given opportunities. Could be the same with Reed as well with Ene and Wills given opportunities. Reed's contract is up at the end of next season anyway so, if he is lucky enough to get capped, I would imagine he'll head north.

I do rate them both, but I would want the DP's, Naya, Van Rhyn, Addison in that 23 as much as possible. Hell Andrews was critical in our final few games.

Additional note - RDP would be EQP by now if he hadn't have played 8 minutes, yes 8 MINUTES, or SA's game against Wales in June 2018. 1 and only cap.
Even worse - wasn't that the game when SA played a load of fringe players so it was a less-than-meaningful game?
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By Yareet
#68718
RinTin wrote:As much of a shame as it may seen, I could see Gus losing game time for us if he gets capped. Nye will be given opportunities. Could be the same with Reed as well with Ene and Wills given opportunities. Reed's contract is up at the end of next season anyway so, if he is lucky enough to get capped, I would imagine he'll head north.

I do rate them both, but I would want the DP's, Naya, Van Rhyn, Addison in that 23 as much as possible. Hell Andrews was critical in our final few games.

Additional note - RDP would be EQP by now if he hadn't have played 8 minutes, yes 8 MINUTES, or SA's game against Wales in June 2018. 1 and only cap.
I think we worked out that Addison can be English again so I reckon we will have a senior squad with 9 non-EQP:

EvR
3 du Preezs
Hyron
Le Roux
Gus
Aaron
Nayacalevu

Trouble is they're all potentially quite key to the 23
User avatar
By Yareet
#68739
wrinklieshark wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2024 10:13 pm
It's available to watch free on Rugbypass, apparently.
Can someone who understands these things please explain in words of one syllable how I can watch at a more civilised time than 6.50 am. Thank you!

WAYS TO WATCH
Watch on your laptop, mobile or tablet at rugbypass.tv
Download RugbyPass TV App for iOS or Android for enhanced features such as Chromecast, Airplay to enable streaming in HD on your TV
ENGLAND’S SUMMER SERIES
Japan v England, Saturday 22 June, National Stadium, kick-off 6.50am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 6 July, Forsyth Barr Stadium, kick-off 8.05am BST
New Zealand v England, Saturday 13 July, Eden Park, kick-off 8.05am BST
@wrinklieshark you might want to sign up this week so you’re good to go for the game

Create your account here: https://rugbypass.tv/signup
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By Olyy
#68762
More full strength than I expected, thought some of the finals players would be rested

Congrats to Big Bev and the two Toms!

TEAM TO PLAY JAPAN
15. George Furbank
14. Immanuel Feyi-Waboso
13. Henry Slade - vice-captain
12. Ollie Lawrence
11. Tommy Freeman
10. Marcus Smith
9. Alex Mitchell
1. Bevan Rodd
2. Jamie George - captain
3. Dan Cole
4. Maro Itoje - vice-captain
5. George Martin
6. Chandler Cunningham-South
7. Sam Underhill
8. Ben Earl - vice-captain

Replacements
16. Theo Dan
17. Joe Marler - vice-captain
18. Will Stuart
19, Charlie Ewels
20. Tom Curry
21. Harry Randall
22. Fin Smith
23. Tom Roebuck
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By Yareet
#68765
Surbiton_Shark wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2024 8:18 am
I hope Spencer is being rested....can't see how Randall gets in ahead of him.

Nice team - obvs good for Roebuck to hopefully get on the pitch
I may be getting this wrong but I don’t think anyone from the final has forced their way into the squad.

By that I mean that those already in the 6N 23 (Furbank, Underhill, etc) are still there but the likes of Spencer and Sleightholme haven’t yet had enough time in this training camp to get into a match day squad.

Edit: scrap that. Ewels is an addition, i think
By Olyy
#68801
43 mins for Rodd

Did ok - few silly penalties early on (though wasn't the only one, first 10 mins was very messy), won 2 scrum penalties and conceded one I think
Bit of a mess up near half time where I think he dummied a tap and go but accidentally made contact with the ball so it had to be played - ended in an England try so not too bad in the end haha
By RinTin
#68814
He hasn't played since the beginning of February, and prior to that was a regular starter for a Toulon side who are known to rotate heavily - he's got to have been injured for a period.

I've mentioned it on other threads here, but the lack of any game time is worrying especially given he's about to turn 34. I know these Fijians are freaks, but he has to have been injured. There is no other reason for him not being in any match day squad.
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By Yareet
#68819
Olyy wrote:
Sun Jun 23, 2024 2:58 pm
Don't think Fiji could pick their Top 14 or Prem players for this game as it's outside the test window
There was a tweet from Mark Evans (ex-Quins CEO, now a big cheese at Fiji rugby) bemoaning this decision.

The game was outside the test window so clubs were under no obligation to release players but it grated on Evans somewhat that Prem and T14 players were allowed to play for the Baabaas.

FWIW, I can see the logic as allowing Fijian players to be released would probably have opened the floodgates to Wales and SA asking as well and that is a huge can of worms to try and close again.
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By Olyy
#68820
From what I understand the Barbarians paid for player release, Fiji didn't

Always been the case tbf - PRL offer extra release for a sum, it's the same to every nation/side, but England is the only one that ponies up the cash because it's the only side that it's worth it for (though Scotland are getting to the point where they might consider it)
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By Yareet
#68896
ledzepsfr wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2024 7:08 am
England v AB's - TC on bench, no Robes
No Rodd either :tears:

15 George Furbank, 14 Immanuel Feyi-Waboso, 13 Henry Slade,12 Ollie Lawrence, 11 Tommy Freeman, 10 Marcus Smith, 9 Alex Mitchell; 1 Joe Marler, 2 Jamie George (c), 3 Will Stuart, 4 Maro Itoje, 5 George Martin, 6 Chandler Cunningham-South, 7 Sam Underhill, 8 Ben Earl

Replacements: 16 Theo Dan, 17 Fin Baxter, 18 Dan Cole, 19 Alex Coles, 20 Tom Curry, 21 Ben Spencer, 22 Fin Smith, 23 Ollie Sleightholme
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